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Author Topic: The final nail in the coffin!!!  (Read 1320 times)
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richi154
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« on: January 20, 2010, 08:53:51 AM »

So it is almost certain now that Cadbury’s will be bought out by Kraft, which I believe is a really sad day for Britain and possibly the final nail in a coffin that holds our great industrial heritage.  Out of all the companies that have either closed or been taken into foreign ownership, Cadbury’s is probably the most iconic ‘English’ company and the sort of enterprise that will never be able to see the light of day again.  In these days when it’s all about the balance sheet, a company like Cadbury’s would not even get off the drawing board.  When I joined The West Midlands Fire Service in 1975, fitness training was a big part of the regime.  We used the Canadian Air Force training programme and in addition on one day each week went swimming at the baths in Bournville built by the Quaker Cadbury family for their workers.  At a time when working conditions were terrible and housing for the majority was squalid, the Cadbury family built nice homes for their employees with gardens and all the facilities they could want.  They looked after their retired workers and those incapacitated during the wars.  Bournville is still one of the nicest parts of Birmingham and a credit to the great Cadbury tradition.  Now a company that made it’s name by making great chocolate and caring for it’s workers is to be owned by a company that built it’s name on plastic cheese slices and reneging on it’s promises and demolishing the Terry’s factory.
I was born in Marston Green on the outskirts of Birmingham and used to catch the bus from the city centre to go home.  Coming out of Birmingham I used to pass the Birds custard factory, followed by the giant car factory displaying the names of their cars in big letters on the front of the building, Humber, Hillman, Singer, Sunbeam, Commer, Karrier.  After that there was the Smiths factory, making the gauges and clocks for cars, followed by Joseph Lucas.  All these have disappeared along with many other great names produced in Birmingham or the surrounding towns and cities such as Lanchester, Alvis, Morris, MG, Austin, Daimler, Rover, HP and many more.  The great Fort Dunlop is now an office block and much of Birmingham’s other traditional industries have either gone or shrunk.  BSA (Birmingham Small Arms) once a gun manufacturer and later motor cycles, went many years ago along with other bike companies such as Norton, Vellocette, Ariel many others.  Fortunately if you want to buy quality bespoke jewellery Birmingham is still the place to come to and if you want a top quality shot gun you will still find people hand building them to your exact specification, but this is hardly the sort of industry that a great city is built on.  Birmingham and of course many other British towns and cities are full of skilled people seeing their skill and talent going to waste.  I can’t understand how whilst we have seen our manufacturing industries disappear other countries still continue to have them.  France, Germany, Italy, Sweden and Czech Republic still have their own car companies, so why haven’t we?
I am not optimistic for the future of Britain, I think that like the Roman Empire before us, we have had our day and the world economy is shifting eastwards and leaving us behind.  I can’t begin to imagine where our jobs are going to come from in 50 years time and of course the resulting decline in wealth and spending power will affect everyone including photographers.  Still we can always rely on that one great British industry that we are good at to see us through….Banking !!!! Ha, ha.
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Richard Potter LSWPP
Matthew Bridge-Wilkinson
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« Reply #1 on: January 20, 2010, 09:28:50 AM »

I will agree that I don't think Craft is the right owner for Cadbury's but its better than it simply sliding into bankruptsy.

It is the worst news since HP was "outsauced".
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Sarah Greenwood
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« Reply #2 on: February 27, 2010, 09:13:13 PM »

Its the price we pay for colonialism me thinks...
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...there are so many ideas I have for my art, they peck away at my mind like demented hens...
David Routledge
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« Reply #3 on: February 28, 2010, 12:06:30 AM »

Hi Richard

I agree it is sad to see the decline of manufacturing in our nation, and the takeover of Cadbury's is indeed a sad reflection of the times. The Christian ethos, to see the love of Jesus in action and not just read out in the pulpits, upon which the original Cadbury family and that of other Quaker business men of their day founded their businesses, was highly commendable and made a real difference to people's lives.

I do take your point about the state of the nation, but I have an optimistic outlook. I believe we will see a rise in Christain businesses in our land, which will be run ethically and with an emphasis on integrity and social conscience (as Cadbury's was), the same social conscience that brought about the abolition of the slave trade and the end to boys sweeping chimneys. It may take a while to come through, but I am very excited about what I believe will be great times ahead. Historically we have led the world in many areas, and contributed much to it, and of course been responsible for some shameful deeds; but I do think we are a nation who can lead, our recent decline and the appalling moral state we are in, is, I believe, due in part to our abandonment of God and our incline towards "freedom" and "enlightenment"

It is fascinating and humbling beyond description to see the response of the Haitian's to their current devestation

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=30rWm84z-zg

 I Pray that a new nation will be reborn, I pray too that there will be a change in our own nation's outlook and consequently its' future.   


God bless
Dave
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I can do all things through Christ who strengthens me
David Butcher
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« Reply #4 on: February 28, 2010, 12:32:55 AM »

.... I can’t understand how whilst we have seen our manufacturing industries disappear other countries still continue to have them.  France, Germany, Italy, Sweden and Czech Republic still have their own car companies, so why haven’t we?

I don't accept that any of those European countries have not seen their manufacturing industries disappearing, especially their car companies.

Starting with Germany .... Mercedes and their very successful flagship Formula 1 race car .... built and developed by a small company called McLaren in Woking, Berkshire, with the engines designed and built by an Italian engineer in Ilford, Essex (Ilmor Engineering) .... financed at least by Mercedes, whose main contribution is the addition of their name and three-pointed star on the engine rocker covers (which only adds weight and hence slows the car down).
Or Volkswagen, who share platforms with Ford, Lancia and Citroen, and build their cars in Spain and Belgium .... and in the Czech Republic, whose largest car manufacturer (Skoda) was taken over and now make rebadged VWs.
Or Opel, owned since 1929 by General Motors and now on the brink of extinction.
Or Porsche, who are continually struggling to avoid bankruptcy.
Or BMW, who although very successful, build their Z1, Z3 and Z4 models in the USA.

Apart from losing Skoda to VW, the Czech Republic has also lost Tatra, and the virtually identical Toyota Aygo / Peugeot 107 / Citroen C1 cars are built there now, as are Hyundai (Korean).

Or the Swedish fighter aircraft and car manufacturer Saab, owned until recently by General Motors and now effectively dead. Or Volvo, owned by Ford, and about to be sold to Geely (in China).

And in France, Renault have slept with Volvo (440 used Renault engines), Peugeot / Citroen (V6 engine, also used by Volvo, was a joint collaboration) plus Nissan and Jeep. The Renault / Peugeot / Citroen group would have closed ages ago but for being state-owned and supported.
Citroen built their SM with a Maserati engine.
Bugatti was bought up by Volkswagen in 1998.
Darracq, Delage, Delahaye, Facel Vega, Matra, Panhard, Rosengart, Simca and Talbot - all long since extinct.

And as for the Italians - the Lancia / Alfa Romeo / Maserati / Abarth / Fiat / Ferrari group would have closed down years ago if they weren't state-owned and supported. Lamborghini is owned by VW / Audi / Seat. They have lost supercar manufacturers such as Bizzarrini, De Tomaso, Innocenti, Iso, Nardi and Osca.

Even the Austrians are not immune - they lost Steyr-Daimler-Puch, although Chrysler build their Voyager there.

Jaguar (previously owned by Ford, now owned by Tata in India), buys their diesel engines in from Peugeot.

It is no fault of Britain, nor is Britain alone here - the entire world economy is shifting and in turmoil, requiring all sorts of companies to get into bed with strangers just to try to keep their heads above water.

My great uncle and aunt lived in Marston Green, I used to love visiting them as a kid and have fond memories of driving past Cadburys, so I too mourn the takover by US giant Kraft .... but if that means that the Cadburys can continue to exist rather than close down and become extinct, Kraft is definitely the lesser of two evils.

And having visited Hershey and tasted their chocolate at its source, I can fully appreciate why the Americans want to buy Cadburys !!
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Sarah Greenwood
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« Reply #5 on: February 28, 2010, 09:43:05 AM »

Hi Richard

I agree it is sad to see the decline of manufacturing in our nation, and the takeover of Cadbury's is indeed a sad reflection of the times. The Christian ethos, to see the love of Jesus in action and not just read out in the pulpits, upon which the original Cadbury family and that of other Quaker business men of their day founded their businesses, was highly commendable and made a real difference to people's lives.

I do take your point about the state of the nation, but I have an optimistic outlook. I believe we will see a rise in Christain businesses in our land, which will be run ethically and with an emphasis on integrity and social conscience (as Cadbury's was), the same social conscience that brought about the abolition of the slave trade and the end to boys sweeping chimneys. It may take a while to come through, but I am very excited about what I believe will be great times ahead. Historically we have led the world in many areas, and contributed much to it, and of course been responsible for some shameful deeds; but I do think we are a nation who can lead, our recent decline and the appalling moral state we are in, is, I believe, due in part to our abandonment of God and our incline towards "freedom" and "enlightenment"

I Pray that a new nation will be reborn, I pray too that there will be a change in our own nation's outlook and consequently its' future.   


And there are plenty of people who are optimistic, ethical, have a social conscience and have integrity that don't go waving their arms about BASHING the friggin bible at EVERY opportunity.
I pray that you shut up talking about the f*cking bible which is quite clearly an attempt at converting people to religion. You are ruining my enjoyment of using the SWPP forums!!!

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...there are so many ideas I have for my art, they peck away at my mind like demented hens...
Sarah Greenwood
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« Reply #6 on: February 28, 2010, 09:43:40 AM »

Good title BTW! I think the final nail went in for me as well!
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...there are so many ideas I have for my art, they peck away at my mind like demented hens...
Dave Nunn
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« Reply #7 on: February 28, 2010, 10:04:53 AM »

Airing your views so strongly on here Sarah will get you nowhere ... apart from a hijack of the original post.

I had a slight run in with David ages ago.  But have found since he is one knowledgeable, friendly guy.  His posts are always informative, positive and I love his optimism and ethical outlook.  if he quotes the bible, which he hasn't in this post, so what .. ? Some of the stuff he comes out with makes me smile and wonder where the hell he gets it all from ...

I am pretty sure most on here now feel the same way as me about David.  If you don't like it, skip it, just don't get angry on here, send him a PM if you feel that strongly, I'm sure he would love the chance to respond to you privately.

Back to topic now would be good ....

We felt the same way when Coors took over the Burton breweries, Burton were the forefront and the worlds best brewers, sh*t happens the world over ....
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martin malocco
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« Reply #8 on: February 28, 2010, 11:00:52 AM »

Sarah,
I have respect for your views but please show the same for those of us who believe in Him
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Sarah Greenwood
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« Reply #9 on: March 01, 2010, 08:38:07 AM »

Sarah,
I have respect for your views but please show the same for those of us who believe in Him

Martin, I too have respect for other peoples views! I don't know why you would think otherwise? You have assumed that I don't have a religion.

The difference is Martin is that I don't RAM my religous views or other views down yours or anyone elses throat insessantly or on a  repetative basis. As I have said on other threads, I don't have a problem with religion, I do have a problem with being preached to though as if I am about to leap from one faith to another just because someone else believes strongly in their own faith.

If everyone who uses this forum continually preached their own faith (as if it was the only one that mattered) then there wouldn't be too many people left on here.

***Sorry for hijack of this thread by myself or anyone who thinks that their version of God should be included in it!

Sarah

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...there are so many ideas I have for my art, they peck away at my mind like demented hens...
JanNelson
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« Reply #10 on: March 01, 2010, 03:56:22 PM »

I for one have no problem with what David says,  if anyone does not like any quotes David makes they can try not reading any posting he puts on the forum but then it will be their loss.  David is one of the most sincere, polite and honest men I have had the pleasure to speak to
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martin malocco
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« Reply #11 on: March 01, 2010, 04:00:45 PM »

I won't comment any further as it is distracting from the op but just want to say
I agree with you Jan. Dave is one of the nicest people I know  Smiley
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David Routledge
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« Reply #12 on: March 01, 2010, 04:40:56 PM »

Thanks Dave, Jan and Martin

Your comments are much appreciated, and I would also like to say that I appreciate Sarah.

I wanted to respond to David's post on the state of the rest of Europe. I have to say David I am more than impressed at your knowledge on this subject, is this something close to your heart, or are you mugging up for a go on Mastermind?

Oh and by the way, my wife profoundly disagrees with you about Hershey bars; if I bring home a Hershey bar she goes weak at the knees Smiley


God bless
Dave
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I can do all things through Christ who strengthens me
Rob Thomas
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« Reply #13 on: March 01, 2010, 05:08:29 PM »

Economics - Politics - Religion

All have an elite looking to subjugate the masses in order to profit and maintain power.

Each of the three has variations looking to become the power broker in their particular field and form alliances with suitable partners in the other two arenas. A constant battle between Venn Diagrams!

It doesn't matter what you believe - the human race is hard wired to operate in this manner. It has operated like this since homonids evolved. The version of economics, politics and religion has morphed to suit the times.

And will continue to do so.
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Sarah Greenwood
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« Reply #14 on: March 01, 2010, 07:04:33 PM »

For those of you that equate my dislike of religious views being rammed down my throat with disliking the person who does it - I am sorry you think that way but you are wrong!

I do not claim that David as a person is nice or not nice. This has nothing to do with his personality. And, actually I am very nice too!!!

Put in more simple terms, if you have allow one person to preach the bible then you must allow the flip side of the coin be it from Muslims, Athiests, Humanists, Pagans, Seikh, Hindu, Bhuddist, Pink Unicorn or The House of the Flying Spaghetti Monster.

Nothing personal!
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...there are so many ideas I have for my art, they peck away at my mind like demented hens...
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